I spent the weekend sending acceptance/rejection emails for Vine Leaves Literary Journal. (We haven't quite finished responding to everyone yet so if you submitted don't get your knickers in a knot.) We had around 250 subs this time. It was a monster job for two people to read them all. But so wonderful to see how much talent is out there. And wonderful to see our cherished project grow and gain more exposure.Back in the day when I was an aspiring writer and sending my stuff to magazines so frequently that I'd get at least one rejection a day, I'd be devastated by every single one. As the years went by the sting got smaller. And now that I co-run a journal myself, a rejection doesn't sting AT ALL. Because now I know that a rejection isn't always a "real" rejection, and a form rejection doesn't mean that we "don't care", "hated your work", "didn't bother even reading the whole thing". (BTW, we ALWAYS read the whole thing even if the beginning doesn't hook us. Sometimes things aren't what they seem until you reach the end.)
How so?
Let's start with the form rejection:
Dawn and I take pride in offering basic feedback on submissions that don't make the cut. And we have promised ourselves, that if we can't manage to offer feedback to at least a third of the rejections, then it's not worth doing this journal. There's nothing worse than not knowing why you were rejected. We get that. And we will maintain that practice no matter how much time it sucks up. BUT. Sometimes there really is just nothing to say. Sometimes, we have to prioritize whose work needs feedback more than others. Sometimes we didn't "feel" it, or "get" it enough to comment adequately. Sometimes, a form rejection just has to happen, otherwise we'd be responding with an essay's worth of feedback that we just don't have time for, so we opt to not give any. Half-arsed feedback doesn't cut it. Form rejection does not = bad. Form rejection just means, most of the time, that it did not resonate with us. But that does not mean no-one else will. Submit your work somewhere else.
Next up, the "not real rejection":
These always include a bit of feedback from us. There are usually a LOT of great pieces that we have to say no to, because the amount of near-perfect subs is high. If that wasn't the case, we'd edit the less-than-perfect subs to our liking, and ask the author if they accept the changes. And if they do, then we publish it. Sometimes we do this anyway if we love the concept of a piece, but the execution leaves little to be desired. If you get a rejection with feedback, it means it's not a "real" rejection. It means we liked your work enough to put in the effort to help you make it better, to let you know it's good, that it's worthy of publishing. It means we'd like to see you submit again, to keep submitting elsewhere, to not give up, because you have talent and potential, and us not wanting this particular piece really doesn't mean anything other than, "we don't have enough space, and we just had to choose."
We feel really sad when we have to reject good work. But that's just how it goes. So next time you get a rejection from someone, try to think of the person behind the screen. And I bet there is a lot more thought behind "it's not right for us" than you think.
Have you ever thought about the person behind the screen when receiving a rejection? Or do you immediately get mad and snap your pencil?
I always feel like I'm getting cryptograms. Like the one recently that said I had a fine writing style and sense of story, but that I needed an editor and then she suggested one. I was thrilled, but then some writer friends said if an agent loves a story, they'd pitch it to a publisher and then THEY would hire an editor. So? I don't know what to think.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I think about the person doing the rejecting, at least a little bit. They make me feel like there is almost no one in the world with tastes similar to mine!
ReplyDeleteI don't get mad; I just don't take it personally. It's not meant personally, and in the end, no = no (unless it's an R&R), so I never thought much about it beyond that. Cumulatively, as they added up and it looked like I might not get an agent with a project, or that my book might not get published, THAT was sort of upsetting. But most individual rejections were not. I never thought too much about the person doing the rejecting, because it didn't matter at that point. I just moved on.
ReplyDeleteI think your philosophy of giving feedback is perfect--there's nothing worse than generic or cryptic feedback where you can't tell if it's truly aimed at YOUR story or if they just put it in there so they could say something, but a small amount of specific feedback that's clearly talking about YOUR book can do a world of good for a receptive writer.
No, I always figured they received hundreds of submissions. Who has time to send a personalized letter with each one? I'm sure you and Dawn have both learned a lot from this experience.
ReplyDeleteI try not to obsess over rejections, but I don't submit a lot of short fiction, so the rejections I get tend to be a bigger deal. I mean I'm not really bothered by query rejections any more, but getting rejected on a full or even a partial can be pretty depressing.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure it's hard to reject when someone is so close. I think that's what small publishers or ezine publishers can offer - a bit more personal rejection. I don't get mad at the people rejecting my work, I try and move on or see how I can make my work better.
ReplyDeleteI ALWAYS think about the person behind the screen who's sending me the rejection. But not in a bad way. I think I've got a pretty decent picture of the gazillions of submissions they get, and I'm uber thrilled when I get a personalized rejection because I know it might be the ONLY personalized one out of several hundred or even several thousand that the agent has looked at in the last days/weeks.
ReplyDeleteHowever. For me, a personalized rejection is THE HARDEST thing to deal with. Because it smacks of the 'you're a cute girl, but it's not like I'd date you' sensation. I know it isn't the same, and I know that personal interactions with agents are an awesome thing, But if I get a 'no thanks' blank rejection, I think 'Okay, obviously no connection was made between them and my writing, no big deal.' Whereas if I get a rejection that compliments my writing (or in several cases one that says they think it's totally marketable and would sell, but isn't quite right for them and they're super busy so they're passing) then I have trouble not obsessing over what I might have done that would have made them go 'Dang it, I just CAN'T reject this.' Because if they liked it enough to send feedback THAT detailed and nice, I know I just missed them by the barest hair. And I always blame myself for that, even if it isn't so. I just look around, and the agents are super busy and swamped and just doing what they have to do, so there isn't anyone else to blame except myself.
I take the view that success and talent are not synonymous and never were. Fate and destiny are also at work as to whether one is rejected or not, as is fashion, circumstance and astrological energies.
ReplyDeleteI did spend a few years getting frustrated about it all but soon realised that 'success' of any kind was ephemeral and meant very little. What matters is writing. When you get a rejection letter just remember it ISN'T PERSONAL and remind yourself that most if not all of the great writers were rejected dozens if not hundreds of times and some in fact were only appreciated after their death. Now that is fate and destiny. So enjoy the writing and take the rejections and the successes with a pinch of salt. At the end of your life your success or lack of it as a writer will not be pre-eminent in your mind.
When I first started submitting poems to magazines there was no Internet. So all my rejections were either pre-printed slips or actual letters. I will be forever grateful to those editors who did take the time to share a few thoughts with me because I was very much alone at the time and continued to be until I did go online some twenty years later. They gave me confidence that I was heading in the right direction. I have no idea how many submissions they were getting but with the ease of the Internet I can only imagine how many most magazines get. My wife ran a couple of webzines that morphed into print magazines and although I was never involved with them in any way—this was when I was working myself into the ground and was devoting all my time to that—but she used to tell me about them. It was obvious that many submitted blindly and really had no idea what her magazines were about. And there were others who simply wouldn’t take no for an answer. You can admire their dogged determination if you like but some people should know when to take a hint.
ReplyDeleteCarrie wasn’t beyond offering feedback but it does become a burden and you might find that too in time. It’s not your job to teach people how to write poetry or what the correct protocols are for submitting but there will always be a special case that deserves some attention. I never bat an eye these days if my stuff is rejected. I sometimes get frustrated by which poems they pick: why is it always the one you stuck in to make up the numbers?
In the old days with the saes you always got a reply. Nowadays even though all they have to do is reply to an e-mail you don’t. If anything really gets to me these days it’s that. I don’t do simultaneous submissions and so that can mean tying a perfectly good poem up for three or more months before sending it elsewhere.
I'm pretty good at rolling with the punches. Like Matt said, a full or partial R hurts a bit more, but everything else just kind of rolls off me.
ReplyDeleteThe best way to handle a rejection is to submit again, right away!
It's good to hear all this from somebody on the other end--Rejections are definitely hard to take.
ReplyDeleteI used to edit a literary journal (The Windsor Review), and it was definitely helpful to see behind the wizard's curtain. The process is subjective, strange, political, and then some. It definitely helps to demystify the process.
ReplyDeleteGlad Vines is doing so well! Very cool.
ReplyDeleteI try not to think too much about my rejections because I realize they can come for so many different reasons. Just try to put them in a box and keep moving forward.
ReplyDeleteI got a rejection on a partial with no feedback- I wish I would have known WHY she didn't like it. I just have to hope it just "wasn't for her" and the writing and all that was fine. But it's still reassuring to hear this from you first hand of what it's like to actually reject someone...Thanks Jessica :) (and awesome on the amount of subs you are getting!!)
ReplyDeleteI know that there should be a reason for every rejection and that I should think like that once the first rejections come in. But damn. I just know that my first rejections will be harsh.
ReplyDeleteI've never taken rejections personally, but it's really interesting to hear it from your perspective. If you're choosing the best out of 250 submissions, you really know you've got the best, don't you?
ReplyDeleteI stopped snapping pencils the first year I subbed. It didn't help, but reading the rejects did. I learned a lot when the agent or editor said why they'd chosen to give me the thumbs down. Thanks for the insider thoughts. Very interesting.
ReplyDeleteIt's nice to hear how much trouble you and Dawn go through for Vine Leaves.
ReplyDeleteWhen I receive a rejection, I'm just disappointed in myself. No ill will for the rejectors. Though getting one on a Saturday afternoon when I was on vacation a couple of summers ago made me feel some ill will against the person who sent it.
I don't get mad about rejections, but I still have to work through some of the sting with certain submissions. I appreciate your thoughts, for I hadn't given it a ton of thought. It really does make sense.
ReplyDeleteI read somewhere recently where an author talked about bad reviews for her book. She said that she realized that her writing wasn't going to be everyone's cup of tea, and that's okay. That stuck with me regarding any of my writing, and helped a lot with rejection.
I don't snap my pencil. I try to see their point of view, sometimes to the point that I'm way overthinking things.
ReplyDeleteWonderful post, and how awesome that you are getting so many subs for VLLJ! Sweet!
Great post, Jess! I have thought about that person before (b/c of my bkg, too). I know form rejections are frustrating for writers (personally), but at the same time, even worse is a quickie, snap "reason" for rejecting that is incomplete or illogical to the person not in the rejector's head.
ReplyDeleteI've gotten those before, too, and often they're out of context, they don't make sense, and it makes me as a writer question my whole concept--LOL! :D So yes, unless you can give a thorough, reasoned response that lets me know I at least communicated *something,* I'll take a form.
You guys are doing a good thing! Can't wait to see the next issue. :o) <3
I've had enough rejections now that I don't worry about them anymore. Sometimes the piece just isn't the right fit. This is truly a great post.
ReplyDeleteHi Jess .. well put - reminding us there's always two sides to the story .. and that's excellent that submissions are so many, and their content so high .. VLLL is helping so many .. cheers Hilary
ReplyDeleteGreat post, Jess! It's always good to look at the other side of the coin. I always consider the "rejector" and appreciate so much when they say why. Even If it's just to say it isn't right for them is better than a form. It's important for us to know when it's subjective and when it's cuz the writing or story is poor.
ReplyDeleteI see from the other comments that opinions vary and I find that interesting.